The
proceedings are reported in the language in which they were spoken
in the committee. In addition, a transcription of the simultaneous
interpretation is included. Where contributors have supplied
corrections to their evidence, these are noted in the
transcript.
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Dechreuodd y cyfarfod am 09:08.
The meeting began at 09:08.
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Cyflwyniad,
Ymddiheuriadau, Dirprwyon a Datganiadau o Fuddiant
Introduction, Apologies, Substitutions and Declarations of
Interest
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[1]
Mike Hedges: Can I start the meeting? Can I welcome
everybody to the meeting?
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[2]
Croeso cynnes iawn i Adam
Price
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A warm welcome to Adam Price
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[3]
who is substituting for Neil McEvoy, who is ill. Janet Finch-Saunders is unable to attend today
because her father is ill.
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[4]
You’re welcome to speak
either in Welsh or English. The simultaneous translation works.
Headsets are available for the translation, from Welsh to English.
There is no need to turn off mobile phones or other electronic
devices, but please ensure that any devices are in silent mode
because, as I can vouch for, it gets awfully embarrassing when it
starts playing music for no apparent reason.
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[5]
Apologies: we’ve had apologies from Janet Finch-Saunders and
Neil McEvoy.
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09:09
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Deisebau
Newydd
New Petitions
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[6]
Mike Hedges: That takes us on to the first item, which is
new petitions. ‘Bring Back January Exams for AS/A level
Students’, submitted with 88 signatures: we’ve written
to the Cabinet Secretary on 4 August. We’ve received a
response, stating that the assessment arrangements, such as January
examinations for AS and A-levels, are a matter for Qualifications
Wales. We’ve written to Qualifications Wales on 23 August,
seeking their views on the petition. We’ve received a
response from them. We’ve got a research brief. The
petitioner was informed that the petition would be considered by
the committee but had not responded when papers for the committee
were being finalised. Has he responded yet?
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[7]
Mr Francis: No.
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[8]
Mike Hedges: What we normally do at this stage is give them
another two weeks to respond. Are we happy to do that?
Yes.
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[9]
The next one is ‘Teachers’ Training Must Include
Statutory Training in Autism’, submitted with 283 signatures.
A letter to the Cabinet Secretary on 4 August. Response received on
16 August. We’ve got a research brief. The petitioner has
also submitted further comments, which are in the papers for the
meeting. The recommendation is that we write to the Cabinet
Secretary for Education to ask whether the Government intends to
address the issue of autism in teacher training through the
forthcoming additional learning needs and education tribunal Bill,
and what the planned timetable for this is. Are we happy with that?
Yes?
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[10]
Gareth Bennett: Yes.
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[11]
Mike Hedges: ‘The
Circuit of Wales’—this petition collected 384
signatures, and 3,279 online. We first wrote to the Cabinet
Secretary on 24 August and received a reply in September. A
research briefing on the petition and related issues has been
prepared. The petitioner has also submitted further comments and
all above responses are in the papers for the meeting. The auditor
general is also looking at it, which means that it may well go
before the Public Accounts Committee. The suggestion is that we
write to both the Public Accounts Committee and the auditor
general. Are we happy to do that? Yes.
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[12]
‘Ensure Disabled People can Access Public Transport As and
When They Need it’—this was done by Whizz-Kidz.
Twenty-two online and 75 paper signatures. Sent to Cabinet
Secretary on 24 August. Response on 10 September. We’ve got a
research brief. The petitioner was informed that the petition would
be considered by the committee but had not responded when papers
for the committee were being finalised. Should we invite the
petitioners in? I’d be very keen to invite them in to come
and talk to us. I think we need to tease out what exactly is the
problem, which public transport and what they want to see done. Are
we happy to invite them in? Yes?
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[13]
Gareth Bennett: Yes.
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[14]
Mr Francis: I think, Chair, just to add on that, because
it’s an organisation with some staffing, and obviously a
range of disabled children and members as well, we could have a
conversation with them about what they feel is the most appropriate
format for that. If a formal committee meeting wasn’t felt
the right way, then you might meet with them in a more informal
session.
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[15]
Mike Hedges: Yes, informally. But I think that it would be
very useful to talk to them because, sometimes, when people put
things in writing it doesn’t always carry exactly what they
mean. That’s not a criticism of that organisation. It’s
definitely a problem for people with disabilities on transport, but
we need to know which transport, what is the problem, and what they
want done. I know, for example, that the people representing the
blind—the Royal National Institute of Blind People—are
very keen on having audio reports on buses saying what stop
they’re at. Because if you can’t see, you can’t
see where you are. I also know that people who suffer from hearing
loss are very keen on having something that they can see to tell
them. So, different disabilities will want different things. I know
that wheelchair access on certain buses is incredibly poor, but on
other buses is very good. So we just need to talk to them about
what they want to see done, whether they want to do it formally or
informally. I’d prefer to see it done formally. I think they
would as well, but we’ll ask them.
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[16]
Gareth Bennett: They’ve got the next petition as well,
I think. It’s the same organisation.
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[17]
Mike Hedges: Yes. If you remember, we received it off them
on the steps a couple of weeks ago—‘Ensure Disabled
People’s Housing Adaption Needs Are Adequately Met’.
Same organisation. We are waiting for a response from them on this.
So, shall we give them another two weeks to respond?
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[18]
Gareth Bennett: Yes.
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[19]
Mike Hedges: There’s a new framework going out as
well, so perhaps they might want to give their views on that. We
can also ask the Welsh Local Government Association and Disability
Wales about the issues they’ve raised.
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[20]
‘A Welsh Government Department for Europe would ensure a
clear, strategic and accountable voice for Wales in ongoing
negotiations’—this was received and collected 22
signatures. I’ve lost the
information on when it was received. We wrote to the First Minister
on 24 August. We’ve had a reply and we’ve got a
research briefing. The petitioner also submitted further comments.
This really is an External Affairs and Additional Legislation
Committee item. We’re dealing with Europe, so shall we
forward it to them? I’m sure they’ll be pleased to
receive it.
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09:15
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[21]
‘The Wildlife Warriors’ was
submitted by the Caerphilly junior forum and collected 13 online
signatures and 83 paper signatures. It was sent to the Cabinet
Secretary for Environment and Rural Affairs on 24 August. There was
a response on 18 September. We’ve got a research brief, but
we’ve not had a response yet, have we? So, we’ll give
them another fortnight to respond.
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09:16
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Y Wybodaeth Ddiweddaraf am
Ddeisebau Blaenorol
Updates to Previous Petitions
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[22]
Mike Hedges: Updates on previous petitions. ‘Save Cardiff
Coal Exchange’ was last considered on 12 July and we were
seeking an update from the Cabinet Secretary for Economy and
Infrastructure and from the leader of Cardiff Council. We’ve
had responses from both. We’ve not had a response from the
petitioner. Again, shall we give the petitioner a fortnight to
respond? Yes.
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[23]
We’ve got two now: one for and one
against the charitable chaplaincy campaign. We’ll take those
both together because they’re both on the same issue, but
they hold entirely opposite points of view. I suggest that we close
both petitions. Okay?
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[24]
Gareth Bennett:
The first one’s been going since
2013. I know the guy is still active in sending letters, but
it’s been taken as far as it can, has it?
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[25]
Mike Hedges: Yes. It just comes down to a matter of opinion. There
are those people who say that a chaplaincy is very useful and very
helpful to people, especially to those coming towards the end of
life and that it gives help and succour to those people and their
families, and there are those who think it’s a complete and
utter waste of time and that health money should be spent on
different things. There’s no meeting of minds there:
it’s either very good or very bad. There isn’t even an
‘it’s okay’ view.
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[26]
Gareth Bennett:
I don’t have any particular view on
it, but what was the view of the Government? Did they come to any
firm decision on this? Has it been considered?
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[27]
Mr Francis: In terms of a bit of the background on this. As you
say, both petitions are long running. Both were started in 2013 and
the previous committee did quite a large amount of work around
this, inviting petitioners in to give evidence. Over the summer,
that information was all gathered back together and the new Cabinet
Secretary for health was written to, summarising all of the issues
that the previous committee had heard. The response, which is in
the papers, for this indicates that the Government is not minded to
change its position on this and, therefore, that chaplaincy
services will continue to be funded out of NHS
resources.
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[28]
Mike Hedges: Shall we close both?
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[29]
Gareth Bennett:
Yes. It’s gone as far as it
can.
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[30]
Mike Hedges: Yes. The Government are not going to change their
mind.
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[31]
‘Give Every Child in Wales the
Meningitis B Vaccine for Free’. We had it on 13 September.
We’ve had further comments from the petitioner. What
we’ve tended to do with these things is: we’ve got the
petitioner’s view and we’ve got the Government’s
view. If we write to Meningitis Now and the Meningitis Research
Foundation to seek their views. It’s a bit like what we did
with cancer in that we’ve had two views, so let’s ask
people who have got expertise on it and see what they tell us. Are
we happy to do that? Yes.
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[32]
‘Abolition of Park Homes Sales
Commission’. If I can remind people, we had a park homes
private Members Bill put in by Peter Black in the last session,
which actually went through. We’ve had this
petition—again, it goes back to December 2013. Rewrite to the
Cabinet Secretary, following research into the park homes industry,
which has been published, and seek the Welsh Government’s
reflections on its recommendations in relation to the ability of
site owners to charge commission on the sale of park
homes—yes?
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[33]
Gareth Bennett:
Yes.
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[34]
Mike Hedges: ‘EMA Attendance Requirements for Young Adult
Carers’—first considered on 13 September. This is a
good news story. The Minister responded. The petitioners have
submitted a response to the Minister’s letter, which
we’ve all seen. The response from the petitioners expresses a
significant degree of satisfaction with the approach being taken by
the Government. So, shall we write to the petitioner and thank them
for their petition and close the petition?
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[35]
Gareth Bennett:
Yes.
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[36]
Mike Hedges: Well, that takes us to the end of that.
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09:20
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Cynnig
o dan Reol Sefydlog 17.42 i Benderfynu Gwahardd y Cyhoedd o’r
Cyfarfod
Motion under Standing Order 17.42 to Resolve to Exclude the Public
from the Meeting
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Cynnig:
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Motion:
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bod y pwyllgor yn penderfynu gwahardd y cyhoedd o
weddill y cyfarfod yn unol â Rheol Sefydlog
17.42(vi).
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that the committee
resolves to exclude the public from the remainder of the meeting in
accordance with Standing Order 17.42(vi).
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Cynigiwyd y cynnig.
Motion moved.
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[37]
Mike Hedges: Near the end of the fourth Assembly, the previous
Petitions Committee carried out a review of the public petitions
arrangements.
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[38]
Can I move to resolve to exclude the
public from the meeting under Standing Order 17.42?
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[39]
Gareth Bennett:
Yes.
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[40]
Mike Hedges: Okay.
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Derbyniwyd y cynnig.
Motion agreed.
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Daeth rhan gyhoeddus y cyfarfod i ben am
09:21.
The public part of the meeting ended at
09:21.
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